Proverbs 26:23 - Revision history

Nick: /* Alfred J. Hoerth */

2022-02-12T11:06:56Z

Alfred J. Hoerth

←Older revision		Revision as of 11:06, 12 February 2022
Line 78:		Line 78:
	:At Proverbs 26:23 in the Masoretic text, “burning lips and a wicked heart” are compared to an earthen vessel covered with “silver dross.” A Ugaritic root allows for the comparison to be rendered “like glaze upon a potsherd.” The New World Translation appropriately renders this proverb: “As a silver glazing overlaid upon a fragment of earthenware are fervent lips along with a bad heart.” [https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/2003526?q=proverbs+26&p=sen Watchtower, July 15, 2003]		:At Proverbs 26:23 in the Masoretic text, “burning lips and a wicked heart” are compared to an earthen vessel covered with “silver dross.” A Ugaritic root allows for the comparison to be rendered “like glaze upon a potsherd.” The New World Translation appropriately renders this proverb: “As a silver glazing overlaid upon a fragment of earthenware are fervent lips along with a bad heart.” [https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/2003526?q=proverbs+26&p=sen Watchtower, July 15, 2003]

-	==Alfred J. Hoerth==	+	===Alfred J. Hoerth===
	Alfred J. Hoerth taught archaeology at Wheaton College for almost thirty years and directed Wheaton's renowned biblical archaeology program. He has participated in numerous archaeological digs and served as coeditor of ''Peoples of the Old Testament World''. He said:		Alfred J. Hoerth taught archaeology at Wheaton College for almost thirty years and directed Wheaton's renowned biblical archaeology program. He has participated in numerous archaeological digs and served as coeditor of ''Peoples of the Old Testament World''. He said:
	:only recently did Ugaritic linguistic studies allow for restoration of the correct rendering of the proverb... The proverb has regained its contrasting parallelism and meaningful imagery. The retrieval of this verse's intent is a small thing in itself, but is a big thing for those interested in the accuracy of translation.		:only recently did Ugaritic linguistic studies allow for restoration of the correct rendering of the proverb... The proverb has regained its contrasting parallelism and meaningful imagery. The retrieval of this verse's intent is a small thing in itself, but is a big thing for those interested in the accuracy of translation.

Nick at 19:52, 11 February 2022

2022-02-11T19:52:07Z

←Older revision		Revision as of 19:52, 11 February 2022
Line 77:		Line 77:
	In the article ''Ugarit—Ancient City in the Shadow of Baal'' the JW site says:		In the article ''Ugarit—Ancient City in the Shadow of Baal'' the JW site says:
	:At Proverbs 26:23 in the Masoretic text, “burning lips and a wicked heart” are compared to an earthen vessel covered with “silver dross.” A Ugaritic root allows for the comparison to be rendered “like glaze upon a potsherd.” The New World Translation appropriately renders this proverb: “As a silver glazing overlaid upon a fragment of earthenware are fervent lips along with a bad heart.” [https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/2003526?q=proverbs+26&p=sen Watchtower, July 15, 2003]		:At Proverbs 26:23 in the Masoretic text, “burning lips and a wicked heart” are compared to an earthen vessel covered with “silver dross.” A Ugaritic root allows for the comparison to be rendered “like glaze upon a potsherd.” The New World Translation appropriately renders this proverb: “As a silver glazing overlaid upon a fragment of earthenware are fervent lips along with a bad heart.” [https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/2003526?q=proverbs+26&p=sen Watchtower, July 15, 2003]
		+
		+	==Alfred J. Hoerth==
		+	Alfred J. Hoerth taught archaeology at Wheaton College for almost thirty years and directed Wheaton's renowned biblical archaeology program. He has participated in numerous archaeological digs and served as coeditor of ''Peoples of the Old Testament World''. He said:
		+	:only recently did Ugaritic linguistic studies allow for restoration of the correct rendering of the proverb... The proverb has regained its contrasting parallelism and meaningful imagery. The retrieval of this verse's intent is a small thing in itself, but is a big thing for those interested in the accuracy of translation.
		+	John Hinton respondedto this claim saying:
		+	:Hoerth's contention that this Proverb should be corrected with the aid of an alleged cognate in Ugaritic that means "common clay pot." He also states that this makes sense of the parallelism, which he otherwise was unable to comprehend. The statement that this Ugaritic "correction" of God's Word returns the parallelism to the text is without merit. The point is that decorating something that is without value not something that is common. The purport of the proverb has never been lost on Bible-believing commentators throughout history; only the modern Bible-scoffer and apostate Christian has had difficulty understanding it. The point of the proverb is that putting silver dross, which is a decoration - on a broken piece of pottery is worthless. The piece of pottery is good for nothing, as are the mouths of the wicked, which produce nothing good.[https://av1611.com/kjbp/ridiculous-kjv-bible-corrections/nonsense-with-ugaritic.html]

	==English Bibles==		==English Bibles==

Nick: /* Silver Dross or Glaze? */

2022-02-05T09:05:50Z

Silver Dross or Glaze?

←Older revision		Revision as of 09:05, 5 February 2022
Line 67:		Line 67:
	:26:23 Like '''<u>a coating of glaze</u>'''<sup>1</sup> over earthenware are fervent<sup>2</sup> lips with an evil heart.<sup>3</sup>		:26:23 Like '''<u>a coating of glaze</u>'''<sup>1</sup> over earthenware are fervent<sup>2</sup> lips with an evil heart.<sup>3</sup>
	::1 tn The traditional translation of “silver dross” (so [[KJV]], [[ASV]], [[NASB]]) never did make much sense because the parallel idea deals with hypocrisy – “fervent lips with an evil heart.” But silver dross would not be used over earthenware – instead it is discarded. Yet the MT clearly has “silver dross” (כֶּסֶף סִיגִים, kesef sigim). Ugaritic turned up a word spsg which means “glaze,” and this found a parallel in Hittite ''zapzaga[y]a''. H. L. Ginsberg repointed the Hebrew text to ''k’sapsagim'', “like glaze,” and this has been adopted by many commentators and recent English versions (e.g., [[NAB]], [[NIV]], [[NRSV]], [[NLT]]). The final ם (''mem'') is then classified as enclitic. See, among others, K. L. Barker, “The Value of Ugaritic for Old Testament Studies,” ''BSac'' 133 (1976): 128-29.		::1 tn The traditional translation of “silver dross” (so [[KJV]], [[ASV]], [[NASB]]) never did make much sense because the parallel idea deals with hypocrisy – “fervent lips with an evil heart.” But silver dross would not be used over earthenware – instead it is discarded. Yet the MT clearly has “silver dross” (כֶּסֶף סִיגִים, kesef sigim). Ugaritic turned up a word spsg which means “glaze,” and this found a parallel in Hittite ''zapzaga[y]a''. H. L. Ginsberg repointed the Hebrew text to ''k’sapsagim'', “like glaze,” and this has been adopted by many commentators and recent English versions (e.g., [[NAB]], [[NIV]], [[NRSV]], [[NLT]]). The final ם (''mem'') is then classified as enclitic. See, among others, K. L. Barker, “The Value of Ugaritic for Old Testament Studies,” ''BSac'' 133 (1976): 128-29.
		+	::2 tn The word translated “fervent” actually means “burning, glowing”; the LXX has “flattering lips” (as if from חָלַק [khalaq] rather than דָּלַק [dalaq]).
		+	::3 sn The analogy fits the second line very well. Glaze makes a vessel look beautiful and certainly different from the clay that it actually is. So is one who has evil intent (“heart”) but covers it with glowing speech.

	;REV		;REV

Nick at 09:01, 5 February 2022

2022-02-05T09:01:27Z

←Older revision		Revision as of 09:01, 5 February 2022
Line 9:		Line 9:
	<small>''([[King James Version]], [[Pure Cambridge Edition]])''</small>		<small>''([[King James Version]], [[Pure Cambridge Edition]])''</small>

-	* '''Proverbs 26:23''' [[01814\|Burning]] [[08193\|lips]] [[07451\|and a wicked]] [[03820\|heart]] ''are like'' [[02789\|a ~~clay pot fragment~~]] [[06823\|covered]] [[03701\|with silver]] [[05509\|dross]].	+	* '''Proverbs 26:23''' [[01814\|Burning]] [[08193\|lips]] [[07451\|and a wicked]] [[03820\|heart]] ''are like'' [[02789\|a potsherd]] [[06823\|covered]] [[03701\|with silver]] [[05509\|dross]].

	<small>''([[King James Version 2016 Edition]])''</small>		<small>''([[King James Version 2016 Edition]])''</small>

Nick at 08:59, 5 February 2022

2022-02-05T08:59:43Z

←Older revision		Revision as of 08:59, 5 February 2022
Line 9:		Line 9:
	<small>''([[King James Version]], [[Pure Cambridge Edition]])''</small>		<small>''([[King James Version]], [[Pure Cambridge Edition]])''</small>

-	* '''Proverbs 26:23''' [[01814\|Burning]] [[08193\|lips]] [[07451\|and a wicked]] [[03820\|heart]] ''are like'' [[02789\|~~earthenware~~]] [[06823\|covered]] [[03701\|with silver]] [[05509\|dross]].	+	* '''Proverbs 26:23''' [[01814\|Burning]] [[08193\|lips]] [[07451\|and a wicked]] [[03820\|heart]] ''are like'' [[02789\|a clay pot fragment]] [[06823\|covered]] [[03701\|with silver]] [[05509\|dross]].

	<small>''([[King James Version 2016 Edition]])''</small>		<small>''([[King James Version 2016 Edition]])''</small>

Nick: /* Postherd */

2022-02-05T08:46:29Z

Postherd

←Older revision		Revision as of 08:46, 5 February 2022
Line 17:		Line 17:
	==Commentary==		==Commentary==
	====Postherd====		====Postherd====
		+	[[Image:OED_Potsherd_1913.JPG\|thumb\|right\|250px\|<small>Potsherd in the Oxford English Dictionary (O.E.D.) of 1913 [https://archive.org/details/in.ernet.dli.2015.99996/page/n1479/mode/2up?view=theater]</small>]]
	Potsherd is from two words: Pot and sherd. Postherd is a fragment of pottery. In specialized usage sherd is preferred over the more common spelling shard.		Potsherd is from two words: Pot and sherd. Postherd is a fragment of pottery. In specialized usage sherd is preferred over the more common spelling shard.

Line 32:		Line 33:
	::[I]n the case of pottery, it [epigraphy] is usually taken to include graffiti scratched with a sharp point, and even painted inscriptions which are made before firing as part of the design of a vase, but not written documents (ostraka), in which pot-sherds are merely used as a material to write on instead of papyrus.		::[I]n the case of pottery, it [epigraphy] is usually taken to include graffiti scratched with a sharp point, and even painted inscriptions which are made before firing as part of the design of a vase, but not written documents (ostraka), in which pot-sherds are merely used as a material to write on instead of papyrus.
	:1950, Alphonse Riesenfeld, “Megalithic Monuments and Megalithic Culture”, in The Megalithic Culture of Melanesia, Leiden: E. J. Brill, OCLC 752624402, page 115:		:1950, Alphonse Riesenfeld, “Megalithic Monuments and Megalithic Culture”, in The Megalithic Culture of Melanesia, Leiden: E. J. Brill, OCLC 752624402, page 115:
-	Speiser, who made excavations on Vao Island found prehistoric potsherds at a depth of 10 inches, and on the surface of the ground also.	+	::Speiser, who made excavations on Vao Island found prehistoric potsherds at a depth of 10 inches, and on the surface of the ground also.
	:2012, Richard A. Freund, Digging through History: Archaeology and Religion from Atlantis to the Holocaust, Lanham, Md.: Rowman & Littlefield Publishers, →ISBN, page 18:		:2012, Richard A. Freund, Digging through History: Archaeology and Religion from Atlantis to the Holocaust, Lanham, Md.: Rowman & Littlefield Publishers, →ISBN, page 18:
	::I have been asked about the single most important artifact that I have seen. It is a single broken piece of pottery no bigger than a couple of inches, but its interpretation makes it one of the most significant artifacts in Jewish history. It is an inscribed potshard (a fragment of pottery) from Masada (in Israel) marked with the name "ben Yair." […] While it remains a single potshard marked in ink, it is a powerful symbol of what motivates archaeologists in the field: a simple object that signifies an entire historical event.		::I have been asked about the single most important artifact that I have seen. It is a single broken piece of pottery no bigger than a couple of inches, but its interpretation makes it one of the most significant artifacts in Jewish history. It is an inscribed potshard (a fragment of pottery) from Masada (in Israel) marked with the name "ben Yair." […] While it remains a single potshard marked in ink, it is a powerful symbol of what motivates archaeologists in the field: a simple object that signifies an entire historical event.
-
-	[[Image:OED_Potsherd_1913.JPG\|thumb\|right\|250px\|<small>Potsherd in the Oxford English Dictionary (O.E.D.) of 1913 [https://archive.org/details/in.ernet.dli.2015.99996/page/n1479/mode/2up?view=theater]</small>]]

	Websters 1828 dictionary has:		Websters 1828 dictionary has:

Nick: /* Postherd */

2022-02-05T08:45:36Z

Postherd

←Older revision		Revision as of 08:45, 5 February 2022
Line 20:		Line 20:

	From pot +‎ sherd, from pot, pote, potte (“a container, pot, vessel; especially an earthenware vessel”) (from late Old English pot, pott (“a pot”), ultimately from Proto-Indo-European budn- (“a type of vessel”)) + sherd (“piece of fired clay or broken earthenware; potsherd”) (from Old English sceard (“a shard, sherd”), from Proto-Germanic skardą (“a nick, notch”)).		From pot +‎ sherd, from pot, pote, potte (“a container, pot, vessel; especially an earthenware vessel”) (from late Old English pot, pott (“a pot”), ultimately from Proto-Indo-European budn- (“a type of vessel”)) + sherd (“piece of fired clay or broken earthenware; potsherd”) (from Old English sceard (“a shard, sherd”), from Proto-Germanic skardą (“a nick, notch”)).
		+
		+	(often archaeology) A piece of ceramic from pottery, often found on an archaeological site.
		+
		+	Synonyms: shard, sherd
		+
		+	:1632, Edward Reynoldes [i.e., Edward Reynolds], “Verse 2”, in An Explication of the Hvndreth and Tenth Psalme: […], London: Imprinted by Felix Kyngston for Robert Bostocke, […], OCLC 19880643, page 149:
		+	::[W]ho can deny but that the rod of Gods mouth is indeed Virga virtutis, a rod of strength, an iron rod, able to deale with all humane reaſonings, as a hammer with a potſherd, which though to the hand of a man it may feele as hard as a rocke, yet is too brittle to endure the blow of an iron rod?
		+	:1720, [Thomas Boston], “State II, Namely, The State of Nature, or of Entire Deprivation”, in Human Nature in Its Four-fold State: […], Edinburgh: Printed by Mr. James McEuen and Company, […]; Michael Boston, editor, Human Nature in Its Fourfold State, […], new edition, Falkirk, Stirlingshire: Printed and sold by Patrick Mair, 1784, OCLC 745149065, head I (The Sinfulness of Man’s Natural State), page 85:
		+	::Job took a potſherd to ſcrape himself, becauſe his hands were as full of boils as his body: This is the caſe of thy corrupt ſoul: not to be recovered but by Jeſus Chriſ, whoſe ſtrength was dried up like a potſherd, Pſal[ms] xxii. 15.
		+	:1916, E. S. Roberts; E[rnest] A[rthur] Gardner, “Criticism and Interpretation [VIII. 2. Epigraphy.]”, in Leonard Whibley, editor, A Companion to Greek Studies: Edited for the Syndics of the University Press, 3rd revised and enlarged edition, Cambridge: At the University Press, OCLC 490495921, section 737 (Definition and Scope), page 687:
		+	::[I]n the case of pottery, it [epigraphy] is usually taken to include graffiti scratched with a sharp point, and even painted inscriptions which are made before firing as part of the design of a vase, but not written documents (ostraka), in which pot-sherds are merely used as a material to write on instead of papyrus.
		+	:1950, Alphonse Riesenfeld, “Megalithic Monuments and Megalithic Culture”, in The Megalithic Culture of Melanesia, Leiden: E. J. Brill, OCLC 752624402, page 115:
		+	Speiser, who made excavations on Vao Island found prehistoric potsherds at a depth of 10 inches, and on the surface of the ground also.
		+	:2012, Richard A. Freund, Digging through History: Archaeology and Religion from Atlantis to the Holocaust, Lanham, Md.: Rowman & Littlefield Publishers, →ISBN, page 18:
		+	::I have been asked about the single most important artifact that I have seen. It is a single broken piece of pottery no bigger than a couple of inches, but its interpretation makes it one of the most significant artifacts in Jewish history. It is an inscribed potshard (a fragment of pottery) from Masada (in Israel) marked with the name "ben Yair." […] While it remains a single potshard marked in ink, it is a powerful symbol of what motivates archaeologists in the field: a simple object that signifies an entire historical event.

	[[Image:OED_Potsherd_1913.JPG\|thumb\|right\|250px\|<small>Potsherd in the Oxford English Dictionary (O.E.D.) of 1913 [https://archive.org/details/in.ernet.dli.2015.99996/page/n1479/mode/2up?view=theater]</small>]]		[[Image:OED_Potsherd_1913.JPG\|thumb\|right\|250px\|<small>Potsherd in the Oxford English Dictionary (O.E.D.) of 1913 [https://archive.org/details/in.ernet.dli.2015.99996/page/n1479/mode/2up?view=theater]</small>]]

Nick: /* Postherd */

2022-02-05T08:42:54Z

Postherd

←Older revision		Revision as of 08:42, 5 February 2022
Line 17:		Line 17:
	==Commentary==		==Commentary==
	====Postherd====		====Postherd====
		+	Potsherd is from two words: Pot and sherd. Postherd is a fragment of pottery. In specialized usage sherd is preferred over the more common spelling shard.
		+
		+	From pot +‎ sherd, from pot, pote, potte (“a container, pot, vessel; especially an earthenware vessel”) (from late Old English pot, pott (“a pot”), ultimately from Proto-Indo-European budn- (“a type of vessel”)) + sherd (“piece of fired clay or broken earthenware; potsherd”) (from Old English sceard (“a shard, sherd”), from Proto-Germanic skardą (“a nick, notch”)).
		+
	[[Image:OED_Potsherd_1913.JPG\|thumb\|right\|250px\|<small>Potsherd in the Oxford English Dictionary (O.E.D.) of 1913 [https://archive.org/details/in.ernet.dli.2015.99996/page/n1479/mode/2up?view=theater]</small>]]		[[Image:OED_Potsherd_1913.JPG\|thumb\|right\|250px\|<small>Potsherd in the Oxford English Dictionary (O.E.D.) of 1913 [https://archive.org/details/in.ernet.dli.2015.99996/page/n1479/mode/2up?view=theater]</small>]]

Nick: /* Postherd */

2022-02-05T08:38:39Z

Postherd

←Older revision		Revision as of 08:38, 5 February 2022
Line 18:		Line 18:
	====Postherd====		====Postherd====
	[[Image:OED_Potsherd_1913.JPG\|thumb\|right\|250px\|<small>Potsherd in the Oxford English Dictionary (O.E.D.) of 1913 [https://archive.org/details/in.ernet.dli.2015.99996/page/n1479/mode/2up?view=theater]</small>]]		[[Image:OED_Potsherd_1913.JPG\|thumb\|right\|250px\|<small>Potsherd in the Oxford English Dictionary (O.E.D.) of 1913 [https://archive.org/details/in.ernet.dli.2015.99996/page/n1479/mode/2up?view=theater]</small>]]
		+
		+	Websters 1828 dictionary has:
		+	:POT'SHERD, ''noun'' A piece or fragment of a broken pot. [[Job 2:8]].

	====Silver Dross or Glaze?====		====Silver Dross or Glaze?====

Nick: /* Commentary */

2022-02-05T08:21:16Z

Commentary

←Older revision		Revision as of 08:21, 5 February 2022
Line 16:		Line 16:

	==Commentary==		==Commentary==
		+	====Postherd====
		+	[[Image:OED_Potsherd_1913.JPG\|thumb\|right\|250px\|<small>Potsherd in the Oxford English Dictionary (O.E.D.) of 1913 [https://archive.org/details/in.ernet.dli.2015.99996/page/n1479/mode/2up?view=theater]</small>]]
		+
	====Silver Dross or Glaze?====		====Silver Dross or Glaze?====
	Some modern scholars claim that the Hebrew כֶּ֣סֶף סִ֭יגִים is mistranslated as "silver dross" and the true reading as revealed in the Ugaritic language should be "gloss".		Some modern scholars claim that the Hebrew כֶּ֣סֶף סִ֭יגִים is mistranslated as "silver dross" and the true reading as revealed in the Ugaritic language should be "gloss".